Are today's culture wars playing out in Christmas movies? | About That

uh hey Julie yes Andrew so like so what

is this

well you know it's it's that time of

year again when the big streamers like

Netflix

uh lifetime these are churning

out their holiday films I don't know I

feel like there's something about

Christmas movies that sort of brings out

these feelings of warmth yeah so so what

is this like like what am I watching

this is this is following for Christmas

starring Lindsay Lohan like this this is

a huge comeback of the year

okay

do we have to watch the whole thing

no I mean this is just an example of a

Christmas movie like it could be any

it can get to my point

okay

so the point I'm trying to make with

Andrew is that the Christmas movie

landscape has fundamentally changed

usually when we think of Christmas

movies we might think of Home Alone Elf

or A Charlie Brown Christmas right but

that's not the kind of Christmas movie

that I want to get into today because

there's a new holiday film that's

emerged in the past 20 years and there's

hundreds of them made every year I'm

talking about Hallmark movies or

lifetime films

this year alone Hallmark came out with

40 new films on their 2022 roster

lifetime had 26 and the Great American

family which is a Christian cable

network had 18. like that's a lot of

movies for one holiday but this year

there's a Twist it's all about culture

wars and somehow Christmas movies are

the latest Battleground so by that I

mean there's a huge difference in

opinion on who should be represented in

these films and how based on belief

systems values and even politics but in

order to understand how Christmas movies

are the latest Battleground for this I

need to get Andrew to understand how

these films are made piece by piece and

for that I'm going to get my friend

Stacy Lee Kong to help him but for now

back to Lindsay

I'm gonna pass on that pop you want some

Walker is it extra butter don't take the

bowl okay

okay

um

we don't have to Die Hard dude

so hey there uh bringing you into our

studio now and you know like I don't

want to say that I was dragged Kicking

and Screaming uh into this place because

I always jump at the chance to speak

with you Stacy Lee Kong sure but you did

not want to talk to me about Christmas

movies I I know it was a little

unexpected I'll admit that you're going

to enjoy it it's going to be okay Stacy

Lee Kong of course uh writer editor

freelancer uh creator of the Friday

things pop culture newsletter and and

we need your help but but more than that

I need your help like full disclosure so

my producer Julie did have to sit me

down and say okay Andrew so so this is

what we're talking about and here's why

it's actually important yeah yeah and so

you're gonna guide us through holiday

movies and and I mean so I know why it's

important because you know Candace

Cameron Bureau like I've been following

that that story right like so you know

how she shifted TV networks to focus on

a network that would uh what was more

family about yeah promote sort of

traditional marriage yeah it's core but

to understand how Christmas movies have

become sort of the battlefield uh of

today for this culture War yeah exactly

we need to understand the the terrain so

to speak and that's where you come in

yes and this giant empty space that you

are going to populate with ideas with

ideas with tropes so also I think we

should clarify we're not just talking

about like any Christmas movie we're

talking about a very particular subset

which is the home Mark lifetime

streaming services are getting into it

like the holiday romance so if you have

watched any of these I know you haven't

but some people will not be surprised by

what I say next there are these tropes

there are these things that you can just

be sure are gonna show up there's a

formula there's a formula yeah I'm gonna

tell it to you okay first of all

we have this briefcase it's going to

come in really really handy all right

and the second thing

so tell me what am I looking at these

right now why you're looking at these is

the protagonist of every holiday Romance

movie is a big city professional with a

cool career she is a real go-getter yeah

and her career is like curator

journalist you know like art yes the

cool career they don't actually know

what journalism means right so this is

the I we could do a whole show on why

journalism and holiday movies is like

not real at all and also deeply

unprofessional but I get you like like

some sort of like high

powerful career yeah okay but then so

she lives in the big city for sure right

but then she has to go to a sometimes

Suburban but often rural Hometown or

place so sometimes it's because it's her

hometown and she's like going back there

sometimes it's because there's some work

reason where she needs to go so like my

all-time favorite is the person who has

to go to the small town to get the

massive Christmas tree for the like big

unveiling of their corporate Christmas

tree back in the city right anyways and

then more tropes come in but importantly

it's it's someplace quaint someplace

homie

and very Community Driven yeah yeah I

gotcha maybe you only one or two street

lights but that's fine okay so okay cool

career going to a small town more tropes

what's next

all right

they're all love stories aren't they

they are all love stories

what this could possibly be about

uh okay well this is the easy part and

I'm assuming I'm I'm not wrong right

that yes well so when she goes back to

or goes to the like rural place she

either reconnects with a former enemy or

lover or like friend or like whatever or

she meets a new love interest so this is

about love yes all right okay what do

you think this is well that

so aside from this person having an

existential crisis and a mental

breakdown it looks like I mean just

problems exactly so it is that there's a

problem to solve but it's a very

particular type of problem okay so it

cannot be a problem that is unsolvable

it is a problem that is it really only

exists to bring the characters together

so like the Christmas tree lights are

not going to get lit up in time the

concert could not go on because the song

was not written whatever it is it's a

thing that is big enough to cause some

dramatic tension but you know manageable

enough right I get you because I mean

passion needs opportunity absolutely

okay yeah absolutely I'm following

you're doing so well

[Laughter]

oh here we go yeah so this is the every

movie needs a happy ending right yes

then the protagonist and her love

interest who like ideally wears a lot of

plaid he's probably very Burly he

definitely does not own a suit it's

really specific it's very specific

um and he like they have to come

together to solve the problem and in the

process they not only fall in love she

learns the true meaning of Christmas

yes very important gotcha Okay so but

then there's this like overarching Trope

that I think is actually the most

important and that is that the the idea

of a good life that these movies and

these like every movie has these tropes

the idea of a good life that these

tropes kind of add up to is very

um conservative so it is traditional

love is between a man and a woman it is

you know sort of this like family values

the next natural thing is you get

married and you have kids and you do all

of these things and so there's kind of

an overarching

republicanism to a lot of the themes in

these movies and that this is a pattern

right so so consistently across many

movies you see this sort of singular

idea of what yeah happy ending

ought to look like but also I think even

more than just a happy ending it's also

like what is a good life so where should

you live and what should your community

look like because the other part of

these movies is that they are

overwhelmingly white and so if there are

racialized characters they're often Side

characters and unless it's a movie

specifically aimed at a particular group

so there are more for example romances

featuring black couples now

um but it just it gives this idea of

life that doesn't actually match up to

like my life or your life yes but

they're vastly like they're just so

popular and there are so many of them

that it seems kind of silly to ignore

this huge messaging around what a good

life looks like and and so now it's

becoming a little clear here to me how

this has become something of a

battlefield for today's culture it's not

just the lumberjacks

[Laughter]

I get the picture although there's still

a part of me that thinks man like

Christmas movies is such a weird venue

for this right but when you lay it out

like this I suppose it's yeah

I think it's like

it's a weird venue but kind of kind of

not a weird venue in that for a long

time Christmas movies were for kids like

when we think about the classics that we

grew up with we were just talking about

the claymation Rudolph like they're kids

movies that's right but what happened

was Hallmark in the early late 90s kind

of early 2000s realized that there's

just a lot of interest in love stories

well and a lot of money and a lot of

money right so like a lot of money okay

um and so it becomes

I think there's an incentive to just

perpetuate the same formula but what

we're going to see is that as audiences

change Hallmark and lifetime which are

the two biggies they had to kind of

update the formula they have to figure

out ways to make it work in 2022 without

losing the familiarity of the things

that we already like because like the

filming the familiarity is the value

proposition what we want is to watch a

movie where we know that everything's

gonna be okay

with the coziness of it it's very cozy

right but you can't have cozy and racist

so unfortunately

or not fortunately for a lot of people

Hallmark and lifetime have been updating

the formula a bit and streaming services

are getting into it right but then that

leaves the sort of larger culture war in

Western Society right now where there's

this move towards progressivism and also

a move towards conservatism

can you tell that the road only gets

bumpier from here we're going to take a

quick commercial break uh we've got a

lot more to discuss at the desk don't

call me

thank you foreign

[Music]

welcome back this isn't about that uh

very unlike the kind of shows we've done

up until this point and we have Stacy

Lee Congo thank for that thank you I

know you don't really mean that I do I

know I do and so today we're trying to

sort through

um you know Christmas movies and

specific kinds of Christmas movies and

and how it is that they have become such

a Battleground for the culture wars of

today and and you are going to take us

through a little bit of a Journey

Through Time right in terms of these

movies because they're they're

instructive they're very instructive

right because the landscape there has

been changes over the last little while

there have been but maybe not as many as

you would expect sure okay yeah fair

point so

um we should also acknowledge that where

I'm going to start in 2018 which is more

than a decade after the first Christmas

movie almost two decades actually after

the first sort of TV Christmas movie and

well after Hallmark realized how

lucrative these could be right so there

has been some change but it took a long

time and it's like not quite as much as

we would like okay also I have props

this is what this diesel is here welcome

to my TED Talk what is this a

gingerbread romance so a gingerbread

romance do you want a little hint you

can make great tree trunks by wrapping

sandwich twists in parchment paper I

made a lot of models when I was in

architecture school thanks this is one

of four movies that came out in 2018

from Hallmark this one is starring

tiamari and Dwayne Henry

um it was one of four movie stars

starring black characters so that was

the first time in our year really 2018.

that's real so this is 2018 was the

first year we saw one of these kind of

made for TV Christmas movies

Hallmark okay for black people wow and

that's the other thing is that the idea

is that these are for black people this

is not like everybody is watching them

they they were like a strategic sort of

Niche Edition okay so it's not that we

haven't seen Christmas movies featuring

black people before but it's that

Hallmark specifically

decision yeah yeah you know like this

this big mate this is a pretty major

change it took until 2018. I get you

okay

next

double uh sorry yes double holiday yeah

because I don't know much about Hanukkah

dinosaur or Christmas cookies no so this

is one of two movies from 2019 that

Hallmark produced featuring Jewish

characters so this is not the first time

ever that Hallmark mentioned Hanukkah

but it is the first time in 2019 that

they saw a strategic Financial you know

capitalist reason to Branch into other

religions right and that's hard to

believe that it wasn't featured earlier

you would think 2019 but is it

surprising well I mean based on the

tropes right here sure but I mean I

think based on the formula the formula

is very specific like Christmas and

Christmas movies for a long time it

wasn't about religion overtly but it was

understanding that you were speaking to

Christian or at least people who were

sort of culturally Christian

that's who your audience was right what

else do you have here okay

the Christmas setup featuring Fran Pine

um so in this is really interesting

because this movie came out in 2020 and

it is a lifetime movie and so lifetime

announced that they were featuring their

very first lgbtq plus couple in August

of 2020. and then a month later

Hallmark Real I talked about how they

were releasing their first lgbtq Class

movie however Hallmark had actually

released their slate of movies in July

so it was not originally on the Slate of

movies wow okay my suspicion is that it

was very late breaking because this

movie received so much press that it

seemed silly not to include that and as

as you're going through these Milestones

it's just occurring to me now you

haven't really talked about whether

there was any backlash to these there

absolutely was was there there's always

backlash so anytime any one of these

pushes like every time there's a push

forward in particular with the Christmas

setup you will see some kind of backlash

from conservative media especially Fox

News but like not only Fox News the

the next thing

so in 2021 lifetime released a movie

featuring the first lesbian couple under

the Christmas tree and that's also I

think pretty important because the type

of representation that we see

it's always coming in drips and jobs so

we'll see gay men before we'll see gay

women we'll see probably a lot of times

both of those before we see people of

color like this is actually pretty

diverse because this is like a person a

racialized person as well and is this I

mean maybe coincidentally or not

coincidentally this is also around the

time where we started to see a bit of a

fracturing right of a landscape our last

moment

Candace Cameron Bureau DJ Tanner DJ

Tanner from below Full House so DJ sorry

no Candace her actual name is Candace

um she leaves Hallmark so she had been

not just a you know a Hallmark holiday

star she also starred in like a mystery

series she was doing very well with

Hallmark and she decided to leave

um for a great American Family she's

starring in one of their 2022 slate of

Christmas movies

um and she said I want to actually read

the quote because she spoke to the Wall

Street Journal and she said that she

made the jump because she knew that the

people behind Great American family were

Christians that loved the Lord and they

wanted to promote Faith programming and

good family entertainment she also said

that she believed that the network would

keep traditional marriage at the core

right so that's really what we're

talking about here we're talking about

two ideas about what a good life looks

like to go back to those tropes and

there's one sort of segment of media

that is moving towards a more

Progressive inclusive diverse idea of

what a good life is maybe one day we

will have a romance set in a city and

then there's this whole other one that

would like to not just maintain the

conservatism of old Hallmark but

probably go backwards

and and so what do you because I I'm

trying to listen to what you're saying

and thinking about whether at any point

you have enjoyed these movies and

whether your enjoyment of them has has

changed changed so I yes have loved

these movies and I actually have a good

friend who we're both in media we're

both cultural critics and every year

we'd be like why are we doing this like

why do we enjoy this so much but we

still did even as we recognized the

flaws even as we recognize that they

didn't really represent us we were

nowhere in these movies unless we wanted

to be the sassy sidekick

but for me I think what has changed is

that

the Comfort isn't there anymore like

it's it's become too hard to ignore

the parts that I don't like the parts

that aren't representative of my life or

the people I know but also

I just don't think this is what we

should be saying a good life is right

but so but I guess the question I'm

trying to get to is can can we have two

things at once right and so like like is

is Candace Cameron Bure a villain for

for wanting to sort of portray the

values that are important to her and to

do the movies that she wants to do like

that's a tricky question I don't think

she's a villain but I think the idea

that her values require the oppression

of other people is pretty villainous so

that's the that's the challenge right

like yes we can just enjoy these things

and try and turn our brains off and if

you can do that in 2022 you deserve to

do that but I don't think you can

actually ignore for too long the

underpinnings

that's the problem is that and and this

is the problem of being the person who

thinks this way and watching anything to

be fair but if you care about other

people to me it's a little bit harder to

be like ah yes we'll just watch Candace

Cameron you're in her other movies when

you know her other movies are explicitly

about oppressing people

they're explicitly about making sure

that we as people think about family and

life and values as one thing and not

often what we are and I guess this is

the the intersection between I mean

business money identity politics race

sex all of those things it just sort of

goes on and on but that's what makes

life interesting right yes

thank you so much thank you for having

me we'll be back on the other side

[Music]

hi my name is Brock my favorite

Christmas movie is die hard it's a

classic Bruce Willis and the Vince we'll

go to the ghost we'll have a few laughs

and then you got Hans Gruber as well one

of the greatest villains of all time I

think Charlie Brown uh I love the

soundtrack

um I love it when his friends come

together he has that

his friends all come to her and they

make it a beautiful one it just really

gets you in the feels every time what if

it feels

that's um sort of it warms the uh the

cockles of your heart you know that's

insane right isn't it hi my name is

Christina my favorite holiday movie is

the holiday it's got romance Little Love

Story it's got self-empowerment and best

of all Christmas fettuccine hi my name

is Oliver and my favorite Christmas

movie of all time is home alone I mean

it reminds me of my childhood like what

parents didn't leave their kids in the

70s to go on vacation right

my name's kit I use they them pronouns

and my favorite holiday movie is Lord of

the Rings I know what some people are

gonna say but firstly the fellowship

leaves Rivendell on December 25th and

secondly The Vibes are just there it is

a holiday movie I'm Erin and my favorite

holiday movie is about a boy which

people don't think of as a holiday movie

but it is not only does Hugh Grant

thrive on the funds derived from his

father writing Santa's super sleigh but

it's about theme importance of

connection with each other and being

together and what is more Christmassy

than that hi I'm Julie and my favorite

Christmas movie is Love Actually I know

it's controversial but there's just so

many stars and celebrity and I just I

can't help it my name is Josie and my

favorite Christmas movie is Meet Me In

St Louis

Judy Garland Have Yourself A Merry

Christmas need I say more hi I'm Adrian

my favorite Christmas movie is Guardians

of the Galaxy I haven't seen it yet but

I'm sure it's great hi I'm Laura and my

favorite holiday movie is the classic

The Grinch Who Stole Christmas the Boris

Karloff version the who's that don't

haunt your dreams it is lovely and

heartwarming the Grinch's heart grew

three sizes that day and my kids love it

so much that my daughter when she was

three or four actually watched it once a

week on average even in July I'm Alex

crest

I can't choose just one so I'm gonna be

quick I got a Fubar two which is a

recent addition to my life if you

haven't seen it you gotta hailing from

Edmonton it is

special Christmas vacation is my classic

that was our family one always and I

loved it because to me it's like a very

true representation of how families

really are at Christmas am I tingling

yeah that's you I was like what does

that sound hey my name is Andrew my

favorite holiday movie is definitely

home alone because like the music is

just fantastic the zany like obstacles

are just like what every boy dreams of

running and maybe like subjecting other

people to and uh Captain McAllister it's

just a bad

foreign

[Music]